In the round-up: Lewis Hamilton voiced concerns over the success of Mercedes’ most recent upgrade following the Dutch Grand Prix.
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In brief
Hamilton unsure over Mercedes’ upgrade
After being disappointed with his eighth-place finish at Zandvoort, Hamilton said the poor result was down to “partly me, partly the car”, and questioned whether the new floor Mercedes raced for the first time last weekend was working as intended.
“I think the car definitely didn’t feel as strong as the last race for some reason. We need to look into that, whether our upgrade is actually delivering or not, we have to wait and see.”
Gasly thrilled with ninth
Pierre Gaslys aid his ninth-place finish at Zandvoort far exceeded Alpine’s expectation.“I’m extremely happy,” he said. “We definitely were not that optimistic yesterday and, what a race, to be fair. Honestly, it was amazing. I had a great start, managed to go around the outside of Lance [Stroll] and Fernando [Alonso] in turn one, which I think was extremely important for our race, and managed to control the race from there on.
“We managed the tyre, Fernando behind was putting quite a lot of pressure all the way through, had a couple of great battle with Lewis and Carlos [Sainz Jnr] as well. It was fun and very pleased we managed to get on top of that midfield.”
Makino pressures team mate into race-losing spin
Tadasuke Makino followed up his breakthrough Super Formula victory earlier this year with another triumph at Motegi, which moves him within five points of championship leader Tomoki Nojiri.
From fifth on the grid, Makino moved into position to win with a superbly-crafted, multi-corner pass on Toshiki Oyu. From there he closed on race-leading team mate Kakunoshin Ohta, who initially rebuffed Makino’s attack, only to succumb under pressure and spin on the penultimate lap. Pole-winner Kenta Yamashita took second ahead of Nojiri.
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Verstappen-Vater wütet gegen Red Bull (Bild - German)
'The team took the wrong turn several times. Internally, you should hold up a mirror and not always sugarcoat everything. It’s time – if it’s not already too late – to question yourself. The good people are leaving the team. I’m very unhappy with what’s happening.'
F1-team Haas mag Zandvoort niet verlaten: oud-sponsor legt beslag op inboedel (NOS - Dutch)
Haas was unable to join its nine rival teams in leaving Zandvoort yesterday due to its ongoing dispute with former sponsor Uralkali, which is seeking the seizure of assets belonging to the team over the termination of their contract in 2022.
The price of F1’s US success (FT)
Liberty Media chief Greg Maffei: 'We are certainly not against the idea that any expansion is wrong. And we’re certainly open to new entrants making applications and potentially being approved if those requirements are met.'
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Notable posts from X (formerly Twitter), TikTok and more:
It's all gone awry for Romain Grosjean.
📺: #PortlandGP on USA and Peacock pic.twitter.com/MiToJKtVSj
— NTT INDYCAR SERIES (@IndyCar) August 25, 2024
Awful bit of driving by @rgrosjean. Spinning away what had been one of his better performances this year is one thing, but rejoining like that is completely out of order. Deserves a severe penalty.#IndyCar
— Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine) August 25, 2024
Some team principals including Red Bull's Christian Horner previously claimed the limited space at tracks such as Zandvoort are why F1 cannot accommodate more than the current 10 teams:https://t.co/kraQp8ZsFz#F1 #DutchGP #RaceFans
— RaceFans (@racefansdotnet) August 25, 2024
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Comment of the day
Lando Norris’ errors earlier in the season have left him with too much to do in the championship fight, says Edvaldo:
imagine if Norris had not fumbled his starts in Spain, Hungary, and Belgium, had better timing with his call for tyres in GBR, and made a clean pass for the lead in Austria.
He would still not be leading but Red Bull would be all over the panic button already.
Now not only he’s 70 points adrift, Red Bull can count on his capacity to not win every race even with the fastest car under him. This kind of crushing superiority that made this race near impossible to lose won’t happen too many times.
Edvaldo
Happy birthday!
Happy birthday to Victor and Apex!
On this day in motorsport
- 40 years ago today McLaren dominated the Dutch Grand Prix at Zandvoort, Alain Prost leading Niki Lauda in a one-two
pcxmac (@pcxmac)
26th August 2024, 2:43
the whole concept of upgrades is just so commentators can explain why things might or might not be good, or are changing, its not actually an intellectually honest way to describe performance variation between cars.
put in hack w/ the fact that Pirelli ARE delivering substandard tires, and COULD be in fact favoring certain teams. The whole idea of upgrades or very even rule breaking parts, could just be subterfuge for attempting to describe why some teams are falling back and moving forward when it could just as well be as simple as the specification of tire Pirelli are ACTUALLY delivering to each venue. And yes, they can build tires for specific suspension setups / tires that would favor certain design philosophies. Tire makers did just that in bike racing not too long ago, before Casey Stoner threatened the world of MotoGP and the confidence of the fans by summarily beating one Valentino Rossi. Which brought in the whole control tire phenomenon back in 2009. Of course the financial crisis was used as an excuse for doing so, but at the end of the day, it’s the confidence of the fans/crowd that is most critical to these branding/marketing exercises.
notagrumpyfan
26th August 2024, 7:52
It always intrigues me when conspiracy theorists refer to ‘intellect’ and ‘honest’. It’s like some weird kind of sado-sarcasm is reverberating in the echo chamber.
spoutnik (@spoutnik)
26th August 2024, 7:57
That Pirelli’s tires could be somewhat inconsistent is far from impossible, but suggesting they favour a particular team or philosophy lies right with other unlikely conspiracy theories backed by no facts at all.
Fer no.65 (@fer-no65)
26th August 2024, 9:34
LOL control tyres are control tyres. They all come in a batch, they are manufactured the same way, and they work as designed. If one team is using them better it’s not because the tyre suiting a particular car, rather the other way around.
pcxmac (@pcxmac)
26th August 2024, 10:58
as someone whose been in manufacturing and works in a multi billion dollar chemistry lab, i would probably know something about production, lot control and recipes. you guys can cry conspiracy theory all you want, but you stink of the same insecurity that compels race organizers to find ways to attract a crowd and generate drama, … and make sure people are glued to their seats through the whole of a championship.
the control tire has always been designed to work towards desired outcomes (those outcomes have shifted since guys like liberty took over, and certainly since Bernie and the days of Bridgestone) of racing, the question is, is pirelli engineering their tires to suit different teams at different times of the year so that ad revenue, and other inflows keep coming in. the answer is simple, there is nothing from stopping it, and a whole bunch of garbage commentary being used to trigger people to drop their ability to think critically. 2021 was very similar.
that said, it might not be the tires, it could be Max intentionally throwing races ala Pete Rose, in an attempt to keep favor with the powers that be, because at the end of the day, its all about money, entertainment, and that great uncanny valley.
notagrumpyfan
26th August 2024, 15:05
Still sounds like an echo chamber rant from a disgruntled janitor of factories and labs :P
Fer no.65 (@fer-no65)
27th August 2024, 5:23
Nah, dude. Just nah…
Keith Campbell (@keithedin)
26th August 2024, 10:43
@pcxmac Tyres are homologated well in advance of the start of the season, and the teams are informed months in advance which of the 5 compounds of slick tyre, C1 to C5, will be brought to each venue. So, I don’t know what point you’re trying to make, since clearly the performance of the teams has varied significantly since the start of the season, but you say it has nothing to do with upgrades. I guess teams should stop wasting their time and money developing their cars and just wait for the tyres to magically adapt to their concept instead.
pcxmac (@pcxmac)
26th August 2024, 11:05
unless they are randomly inspecting the tires via 3rd party, full chemical breakdown, etc you dont know that those tires are all the same. homologated doesn’t mean manufactured. this is the problem with control tires, you have to accept that a company who has been asked to spice up racing, is honest in what they are offering you. and this makes zero sense unless the teams are operating under duress. competition is really the best option, for attempting to guarantee good faith by a tire maker. if it cant be done then put the cars on commercial off the shelf tires, and use an open/transparent/random procurement process.
Jay
26th August 2024, 12:15
I actually find this logic interesting. But if what you say is true, why wouldn’t all of the teams be more interested in ‘full chemical breakdown’ or whatever, of tires after races? If there’s a possibility of favourtism, every team would want to know if they’re a victim and who’s being favoured.
AlanD
26th August 2024, 20:34
My understanding was that the tyre sets are delivered to the FIA, and the FIA allocates them to cars, i.e. it is not possible for Pirelli to know which car or team will get any particular tyre. I think I read somewhere that each tyre if barcoded so that the FIA can check a car uses only the tyres specicially allocated to it. But I cannot remember where I read about this so I might be talking rubbish.
pcxmac (@pcxmac)
28th August 2024, 19:23
The only way to almost guarantee fairness is through some sort of lottery (at the race), and extensive testing scheme the year prior, through some sort of mule car that can be used to completely flesh out the carcass/compounds, thermal loading capacity, allow the teams to model the tires to achieve a high degree of correlation, in order to fully optimize the tire loading strategy, which has a lot to do with weight distribution, suspension setup, aero-downforce focal points/gradients, track conditions etc.
AND manufacture ALL tires, before the season starts, and to allow customers to sample tires at every event, to take to their own labs in order to do their own in house quality assurance testing.
Keith Campbell (@keithedin)
27th August 2024, 10:54
@pcxmac If any of the teams had the slightest suspicion that they were being sabotaged by the FIA and the official tyre manufacturer then you can be sure they would be screaming bloody murder. Instead, none of the teams have uttered a word suggesting this – not a driver, a team principle, an engineer or a media representative – nothing. If this is a conspiracy, then it is one of the best contained conspiracies ever devised. Also, the FIA and Pirelli would be risking catastrophic consequences and could be prosecuted for fraud if this very easily detected conspiracy was uncovered and one of the aggrieved parties decided to pursue legal action, not to mention the reputational damage to their brands.
There is far too much to lose to take such a risk just for the sake of increased viewer numbers for a season. Pirelli already have the supply contract, and I don’t know if their compensation is dependent on viewership, but I doubt there is a direct link, so very little to gain for them other than improved relations with the FIA which would count for nothing if this was found out because they would definitely not be allowed to continue as the F1 tyre supplier if this scandal came out.
pcxmac (@pcxmac)
28th August 2024, 19:30
not really, one level above the spectacle (society of, being an interesting read/watch btw), are the bean collectors, who care more about sustainability/profitability people paying for seats, cable subscriptions, advertiser income, sponsors, etc…
While its safe to assume a lot of really competitive peeps in F1 DO care about results, and being able to demand high bill sponsors, payoffs, etc.. I am telling you there are teams like Williams who only care about the big picture, saying the same stupid lines, and serving stake holder intersts Like w/ one James V serving as a proxy for Toto @ Williams.
The stuff that will hurt the piggy bank is not going to be likely discussed in the media or publicly, this means much more than any individual or team, and in order to play in F1, you pretty much have to be approved and sign on the dotted line. The FIA I believe does some of this stuff literally with I think some sort of code of conduct, etc. I believe anyways.
What is most important to F1, Liberty, guys like Toto, stakeholders, major sponsors etc, is the cohesion of the existing teams, ability attract attention and keep profitability. Guys like CH and RBR threaten this order because they actually try to compete in a system that is more or less designed to be a spectacle almost entirely. Stability and those who threaten this order, are dangerous to the stake holders of F1, and why F1 needs to ditch liberty, guys like Toto, and become what it used to be, a bunch of dudes beating feat and demonstrating true ingenuity.
Jere (@jerejj)
26th August 2024, 7:02
Even though Haas couldn’t leave equipment from Zandvoort as early as planned, I’m sure they’ll still be able to leave early enough to avoid their Italian GP participation ending up under threat.
Totally careless rejoining by Grosjean, just like in the 2018 Spanish GP.
Although most current circuits are the same as in 2010-12 when 12 teams competed, so only applicable to Zandvoort or any other circuit that wasn’t in F1 in the early-2010s.
COTD: Indeed, but he’ll have a better chance next year when the season should start similarly to how this season has been, on average, from Miami GP onwards.
MacLeod (@macleod)
26th August 2024, 8:07
@jerejj It’s only 1 day on the road to Monza. But I find it strange that the amount is not paid to the Dutch arbitors who hold the Haas goods. Now it’s going to the Middle east so it can escape sanctions that i find very strange Haas should pay the Dutch who holds the money untill the war is over (or giving to their victims)
MacLeod (@macleod)
26th August 2024, 8:10
ZAndvoort has not that problem any more as they have room for 11 teams after the extention. The enlarge the pitlane in lenght And in width.
notagrumpyfan
26th August 2024, 8:30
Just six months ago many commenters predicted that 24 & 25 should be similar to 23 for RBR and Verstappen.
How quickly things can change, and how quickly people forget that.
AlexS
26th August 2024, 8:20
Seems Grosjean situational awareness continues to be problematic.
An Sionnach
26th August 2024, 12:46
At least his car is easy to see. Watch out for it in the supermarket car park!
GechiChan (@gechichan)
27th August 2024, 9:59
The fight for power at RBR is obviously killing their performance, which I really enjoy. Horner was able to keep a hold of his seat when the car was still dominant, but now the knives are getting sharpened again and if RBR lose the constructors’ championship, it might be the end of his tenure.
grat
27th August 2024, 19:59
…. as long as it’s not Michael Andretti.